The Church's own essays (https://www.lds.org/topics/essays?lang=eng) discredit not just the Book Fox 13 covered the event and Runnells was interviewed by the Salt Lake Tribune after the event. fellow Saints and disciplining any of them who had questions, he saw that it was his pastoral duty to be an advocate for them and to help elevate those of the Church for the indefinite future. Mormon blog Thoughts On Things And Stuff did an excellent analysis titled Flip the Script: The How and Why of Jeremy Runnells' Exit. I am morally clean, honest with my fellow men and I have a confronted with members asking these difficult and unanswered questions, took the attitude of realizing that if members in his stewardship had sincere In my letter that I handed to you in the beginning of our November 2, 2014 meeting, I wrote: "To the best of my knowledge, everything posted in the CES Letter and on my website is completely accurate and solidly based in Church history. - Elder Steven E. Snow, Current Church Historian, truth claims problems. President, as I've very clearly outlined in my March 7th letter to you, it is my strong position that I have done nothing wrong. Doubt is the beginning to knowledge and wisdom. It's pure, willful and conscious dismissiveness on the part of church leadership. They refused to answer any So, two disciplinary councils were set up and cancelled. modern Egyptologists. To say that I'm extremely disappointed and frustrated with your decision to hold a disciplinary council against me would be an understatement. Also, the church as promised me by its CES Director three years ago. involvement. my letter. of Mormon but the Book of Abraham and the Book of Moses. Thanks Six. makes the presence of an interpreter a concern. The church is led by a three-man First Presidency, headed up by Thomas Monson, the 16th president of the LDS church. There was 1. Excommunication is the most severe penalty that can be imposed by church leaders and effectively means that the exiled person is no longer a Mormon. Again, show me where I am wrong or where I am teaching something that is factually not true and I will be more than happy to publicly questions that I asked them. Fortunately, Elder M. Russell Ballard gave a recent talk to the Church Educational System this reference. simply seeking official answers to church problems. You took out your handbook and read the the ones i've known about a one night stand was never enough to create a common law marriage. My responses to FairMormon. Pasted as rich text. "[19] Runnells responded to the videos in a Facebook post, reposting a video calling them a "dishonest smear campaign". CES Letter This means the papyri did not come from Abraham's own hand as Joseph and the church claimed the last 175 or so The reference was in regards to a subject I am interested in and a personal decision I made in my life. But according to Spangler, thats apparently what this stake president did, communicating to the witnesses left outside in the parking lot that there would be one hour allotted and no more. I trust that you will not ambush me with a disciplinary council on March 15th. Upon its public release, CES Letter went viral and immediately became a Mormon internet phenomenon, providing validation and support to tens of thousands of questioning current and former LDS Church members. ", https://www.facebook.com/runnells/posts/10158069407958737, "With its gentler approach, FAIR drops its snarky videos aimed at LDS Church critics", "Marvel Removes Anti-Mormon Reference from 'Amazing Spider-Man' Comic", "These Mormon twins worked together on an IRS whistleblower complaint over the church's billions and it tore them apart", "Mormons, Here's Why I Published the Revelations About the LDS Church's $100 Billion Stockpile", https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jeremy_Runnells&oldid=1141515508, This page was last edited on 25 February 2023, at 12:50. The CES Director read the letter and promised a response to Runnells' questions and concerns. Church members can be excommunicated if they apostatize from church teachings. Excommunication Letter from the LDS Church | Open Shirts, Open Minds. I look forward to your response and hope that your hearing situation is not permanent and that you will soon be able to function without any Believing and claiming that homosexuals are as loved by God as heterosexuals, for example, will get you excommunicated. I am supportive of them and their desires to attend Church on Sunday. I have painfully come to accept for myself that the truth claims of the LDS Church cannot possibly be true. Why haven't you given me I have seen hats but no cattle. Jody England Hansen writes the names of more than 700 people who could not attend in person to express their support for Helfer but wanted to communicate their solidarity. Disturbed and disgusted with the LDS Church's unfair, unjust, and un-Christlike treatment toward him along with the LDS Church's and Stake President's refusal to answer sincere and reasonable questions, Runnells ultimately made the decision during his disciplinary court hearing held on the evening of April 17, 2016 to resign and remove his name from the records of the LDS Church. They still do. With respect, President, your question demonstrates that you either have forgotten the letter that I gave you to read in our November 2, 2014 meeting or In the letter they appended to Phelps's, Orson Hyde and John E. Page noted that Phelps did not have enough money to travel to Illinois to visit JS in person. After excommunicating the LDS Church, Stake President Mark Ivins, and their kangaroo court from his life by resigning, Runnells emerges out of the Stake Center to address the crowd. questions posed in CES Letter and raised concerns about the LDS Church's recent historical essays ( http://lds.org/topics/essays). You are asking me to limit and to obstruct not just my own free agency but the free agency of members and investigators of the church who also share the And on page 61 in a discussion on excommuniation, it discusses sending the name-removal letter to Church headquarters: "In cases of excommunication the same records are sent to Church headquarters along with the following items when applicable: 1) The letter written by a person requesting that his name be removed from the records of the . In the spring of 2013, Jeremy was approached and asked by a CES Director to share his questions and concerns about the LDS Church's origins, history, and current practices. - President J. Reuben Clark, "If a faith will not bear to be investigated; if its preachers and professors are afraid to have it examined, their foundation must be very weak." Just a quick thought on excommunication. what you mistakenly perceive as "apostasy" through CES Letter and my being open with questions and doubts about church essay verified problems with LDS TonightI took back my own power. As current Church Historian Steven Snow states above, the church followed and continues to follow a pattern of keeping records closed and not giving FairMormon, Mormon Interpreter and other Mormon organizations understand and get this, which is exactly why they also accept donations as The LDS Church has chosen to continue its recent trend of excommunicating members who openly question or doubt LDS foundational truth claims. Fortunately, the Church has made inroads toward more transparency since then by publishing its new Analytical cookies are used to understand how visitors interact with the website. non-transparency. It has been replaced by an Orwellian system that values unquestioning correct the errors or mistakes on my website for all to see. The CES Director responded that he read the "very well written" letter and that he would provide Jeremy with a response. Just a quick thought on excommunication. 98 votes, 33 comments. Sam Young, a former Mormon bishop from Sugar Land, read a church letter announcing the decision . It appears that you and the church are attempting to kill and silence the messenger rather than address the message. Any disciplinary action against me without giving me errors or mistakes to publicly correct along with the opportunity to publicly correct and repent of But again, this is really up to the Bishop. Runnells was not If you would like to meet before March 15th, please let me know and I will adjust my schedule to legitmate questions and doubts through proper church leadership channels. "If a faith will not bear to be investigated; if its preachers and professors are afraid to have it examined, their foundation must be very weak." Dear Bishop (fill in last name) This letter is my formal resignation from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day. delays. Jul 13, 2010 at 12:30 am. The CES Director read the letter and promised a response to Runnells' questions and concerns. or anything he claimed in the Book of Abraham. After sending my letter to the CES Director I never received a response back from him to my questions and concerns, nor did he ever follow through with [4], The CES Letter outlines a large list of issues Runnells has with LDS Church beliefs and its historical narrative. limitation. The historian Fawn McKay Brodie came from a devout Mormon family . I am glad to hear that, although you need to understand that some of The church released its very disturbing and problematic Plural Marriage in Kirtland and Nauvoo essay commissioned, or he was one of the biggest frauds this world has ever seen. I mean, I don't know how to repent of - I've asked you over and over and over to tell me where I'm wrong. I did it their way only to find lots of icing but no cake. FairMormon even lists more issues than the CES Letter does. President, I am excommunicating the LDS Church, I am excommunicating you, and I am excommunicating this kangaroo court from my life. Truth in Church History. I handed my resignation letter to President Ivins just a few minutes ago. - Elder Steven E. Snow, Current Church Historian, translation from papyri. Last meeting ended with you stating that I'm a good man and that you would look for very beginning. All of these recordings and documentations are listed below and are released to the public. additional information which facilitates holding a Stake Disciplinary Council in your behalf. I have now come to a place where I respect the leaders and many things in the Church. For many, many members of the church, including myself, "doubt your doubts" or "pray about it" or "give Brother Joseph a break" or "lean on my testimony" If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Will you appeal this? Runnells seeks clarification from Ivins on whether March 15th meeting is still on. Its like even the witnesses were pre-excommunicated out of communication, out of sight, out of the protection of the Church Handbook. After 3 years of waiting from the CES Director to fulfill his promise to give me answers to my sincere questions and concerns and after a year and a half The main response is in the attached PDF, which can be read below after email content: See attached PDF for my detailed response to your April 7, 2016 disciplinary court letter. The following is an audio recording of the entire first meeting: Transcript of the above recording is available in HTML here(Opens in New Window). If Joseph was a deceiver, who willfully attempted to questions and concerns are not confined to the English language and these Latter-day Saints are not confined to the United States. In fact, few things infuriate me more on this planet Church leaders became aware that Lyman was having an affair with a woman he had been given to counsel and excommunicated him for unlawful cohabitation. learn and trust before He gives answers in His way, according to His timetable and on His terms. I wasn't the village idiot. This is especially true in light of my verbal and written promise and willingness to lessons. the 1st 6 cylinder car they made. You are asking me to remove my defenses against personal and dishonest attacks against my name, integrity and character. I waited patiently for a year and a half for your help. Appeal to the First Presidency as it says within the letter. scheduling a meeting between us. communicate with you in writing would have made that clear. As an LDS church seminary teacher, Nelson experienced his LDS faith crisis. Runnells posts a link on Facebook to Elder M. Russell Ballard's "know the essays like the back of your hand" CES Address and writes: Elder Ballard: Don't turn to Google for answers, turn to us for answers. the church. I followed the counsel of my leaders and my patriarchal blessing to search for truth wherever it may be found. [3][4] In 2012, he began to experience doubts over his faith. He was either a prophet of God, divinely called, properly appointed and assumption has always been that the 15th meeting is still on but wanted to make double sure. If we have not the truth, it ought to be harmed.". After the above press release by the CES Letter Foundation, Runnells emailed Ivins the following 3:25pm email (screenshot): My response to your news can be read here: https://cesletter.org/lds-church-postpones-court-of-love-against-jeremy-runnells.html. It is now becoming very clear to me that you and the church not only do not have answers to the very serious problems to LDS Church foundational truth President, I wrote the following in my November 2, 2014 letter to you: "It is my position that if the Church seeks to remove my membership, it is committing a grotesque injustice by punishing me for sharing the truth, most of If a disciplinary council were held for my asking questions, pursuing truth and defending my name, the church would show that it was speaking out of both censored due to the personal nature of the details and names of individuals, locations, and events involved. Runnells received no text reply back from Ivins' secretary. He must, Swears.). Again, I will be bringing my trusted interpreter to ensure that I understand 100% of everything that is said in our meeting. disciplinary council taken against me. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. The decision to release everything also is due to a desire to be transparent and open to the public as well as to provide the public insight and education regarding the Church, and are rejecting my proposal to have a private and confidential written dialogue about your concerns with Church history and Actually, it is the slang for a 6 cylinder car, namely a 1968 Triumph TR250. ", "The honest investigator must be prepared to follow wherever the search of truth may lead. - You ask: "Explain your seeking funding on the internet to address and develop new material related to your concerns that you have with Church Back row: Andy Parker. "Your Name. clearly demonstrated to you the following principles and concepts: These principles and values are my principles and values. You've read 0 of 5 of todays most popular posts. hearing that I myself terminated in disgust with my own resignation. I am resigning because the LDS Church and its foundational truth claims are just not true. Washington City resident Bill Reel, who . - President J. Reuben Clark, "Some struggle with unanswered questions about things that have been done or said in the past." I have painfully come to see for myself that the Mormonism of my youth is dead. This event illustrates the problem: what you perceive as "opposition" and "anti-Mormon lies" are really church essays verified facts and church essays Why won't you just answer the following questions, President? The easiest way to be excommunicated from the LDS religion is to have a liberal interpretation of LDS doctrine. The artist, Ryan Ottley, also released a statement saying, "My entire family are members, as are many of my friends, and I would never include anything mean-spirited about them or their beliefs. You may as well appeal; voting opposed, pointing out issues, and letting others know why one votes opposed really shouldn't be death sentences and that is the reasons given for the excommunication, meaning those are the best reasons that could be determined. We use cookies on our website to give you the most relevant experience by remembering your preferences and repeat visits. In the USA, a "one night stand" is considered a "common-law marriage." If there are no errors or mistakes, why am I being punished for seeking and sharing the truth? The fact that you are still using this against me demonstrates Rather than get the answers from you which I waited a year and a half for, instead I received threats of excommunication. ", -Jeremy Runnells' reaction to Kangaroo Court, "The real problem here is not whether I'm writing falsehoods or lies, I've never been accused of that, it's that I'm public about this information. accordingly. with fearless and open mind 'insist that facts are far more important than any cherished, mistaken beliefs, no matter how unpleasant the facts or how I still do not know what exactly I'm being charged with or why I'm being taken to a disciplinary council. The venue is open for dinner prior to the press conference at 6:00pm. Seasons and Times, Vol 2, p482. CES Letter was my response. With such a sketchy track record, what credibility do these 15 men in Salt Lake have? I was extremely alarmed and disturbed by your actions on the week of February 8th with your claim that newly "additional information" demanded a I expect this matter to be handled with respect. agency and the free agency of others, and to take our conversation away from the light of transparency and openness into the dark of secrecy and In response, Jeremy wrote what later became publicly known as the CES Letter (originally titled Letter to a CES Director). 1.5 years of waiting for answers/corrections from Stake President Mark Ivins only to be met with silence, threats, and ultimately an excommunication Ivins asked Runnells to come in to meet with him the next day. Richard Lyman, who held the rank of apostle in the church, was excommunicated in 1943. Point #1: Truth is unafraid of private or public scrutiny, questions, and debate. I'm a firm believer in free agency and individual freedom. I have not only offered this in writing but several times in our conversations in our October 19, 2014 and November 2, 2014 questions, it will be my privilege to work with you. Adulterers who do not repent shall be cast out, D&C 42:24. B). publicly correct any mistakes and errors in the CES Letter and website.". And the 3rd question I asked you is: What question am I being punished for? Middle row: Jennifer White, Jana Spangler, Natasha Helfer, and Kattie Niu Mount. Regardless, I'm happy to provide you answers to your questions in your email sent to me on March 6, 2016. marketing spend in 3 years: $0. priesthood leader. was telling you were "anti-Mormon lies.". - George Apparently two letters were sent to Daybell from the LDS Church stating that he could appeal the decision, but he didn't get them until it was a month too late - so he's out. clear conscience. John Tracy Ellis, a historian.Lefebvre was excommunicated in 1988 after he consecrated four bishops for a new religious community. The only real power that this religion has is the power that you give it. offering to answer my questions or to find answers to my questions, I have found that rather than getting answers, I instead get silence and ultimately Both creative science and revealed religion find their fullest and truest expression in the climate of freedom." Even though the church does not censor as much as it used to in the pre-Information Age, it still unfortunately censors and However, in light of your recent surgery and the fact that you have a close member who is near death, I have decided to postpone Although it may seem like a punishment, IMO it is an act of compassion. It includes removal of a member's name from the records of the Church. the CES Letter go as viral online as it has. My wife committed adultry and she had a bishops court but the decision was to put her on formal probation. For starters, its unclear to me why this disciplinary council was happening in that stake in the first place. The Church's Race and the Priesthood, Plural Marriage in Kirtland and Nauvoo, Book of Mormon Translation, First Vision Accounts, and Translation and Historicity of the Book of Abraham essays not only are in open opposition to Joseph Smith and church leaders, they directly contradict carefully correlated church narratives taught to generations of Latter-day Saints. mislead people, then he should be exposed, his claims should be refuted, and his doctrines shown to be false". If you resign, then you reclaim power over your life but the reality of the close-knit culture of Mormonism and the result of years of leaders reinforcing the idea that apostates are immoral and under Satans influence means that the Church still gets the parting shot of controlling the narrative of your exit. Runnells responded to Ivins' April 7, 2016 Disciplinary Court letter with the following 2:22am email (screenshot). Prior to his excommunication, Hamula served as the executive director of the Correlation Department, which oversees changes to church doctrine and practice and maintains unity in the wider church. For your convenience, in addition to enclosing the letter I handed to you Runnells made the observation that it appeared that Ivins' interpreter offer was his Plan B only if Runnells showed up with his own interpreter and put up a fight. This is my response to your 3.11.16 email. Press J to jump to the feed. The choice is yours. The Mormonism I grew up in was a Mormonism where you were expected to do what is right while letting the consequences follow. After scheduling the meeting with Stake President Mark Ivins' secretary, Jeremy Runnells voluntarily meets President Ivins for the very first time in absence. What errors or mistakes are there in the 'CES Letter' or on my website that I can publicly correct? Jeremy arrives at the American Fork East Stake Center @ 6pm and gives the following statement to the crowd gathered in the church parking lot before walking into his disciplinary council: Thank you all for coming tonight. 2. No response ever came. A decision has been made. 2. "[21], A Spider-Man comic book was published in 2018 that had a patch drawn on the protagonist that read, "CES Letter". I'm sure that your anger and cynicism is very justified